TranscriptPlanning Board Meeting ~ May 10, 2017

10th uh meeting of the Durham Planning Board and uh I will start with establishing the quorum which we have and then we will move on to the pledge of allegiance. United States of America and to the republic for which it stands, one nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all. [clears throat]

No. Acceptance of minutes for the April 5th meeting. You should have a copy of those. Thank you, Joe. [music] [clears throat] Okay. Make a motion to approve the meeting minutes from April 5th, 2017. Second. All those Baldwin, Mineral Springs Estates. Come on up.

Thank you. Got some trying to earn frequent flyer points. What's that? Trying to earn freom flyer miles. Yeah, I'm not that easy to get rid of. But this is a new uh I didn't get get it in time to get it in the uh it's it's a

road maintenance agreement and the plan profile. Think I got the rest of the copies here. Oh, I'm sorry. Well, I thought you were just giving us two. I was like, "Oh, I got nine, but you got already." You want one? I'll take you want the rest.

Yeah. Calvin, get one. with me, too. [laughter] a new uh plan I have changed uh on that last lot where there was a question about being more than 20% grade. contains a building envelope. So, which plan are you looking at now? The

the survey plan. The site plan. Not not the N yet. Extra copy of the little one. Uh, I got I got a bunch of [laughter] I was looking at that tonight because I don't have mine either. [laughter] Not as recent as your small one.

Yep. I've got two or three. We're looking [clears throat] at small one or a big one. Well, they don't all have big. Well, they're the same. It's There's two or three big ones. Yeah, you need to look at the subdivision boundary. [clears throat]

The smaller one. Yeah, there's a smaller one with that. A7 2017. What's that now? You need to look at the subdivision the the I gave it to John. Where are the large ones? Oh, I turned in at least two of those. Maybe three.

I got more. This is all we got. Yeah, that's where we're put. When I turned the pack again, I gave him three of the big ones. I think two or three where those are. Do you have a Kelvin? Do you have a L the lodge plan? That's this one here.

That is that one. Okay, I think we're good now. All right. [clears throat] have changed on the plan were that were missing problem was the billing envelope. 20%. note is it explains on the read this. The inland waiting board the 250 setback on both sides of that is included in that area. [clears throat] The note states that it didn't. about 500 ft of that whole bird waiting thing is not that

that is on my on the legend I'm looking at not on the notes it's on the legend okay well uh almost what other issues there were with that. I think that was dealing with the profile. Um I don't know if we just start right at that checklist and take all the take all these boxes that say incomplete

do and just see if it's on the plan. Yeah. incomplete on that checklist [cough] Are we I guess I could ask a technicality question since we didn't really have the plan submitted for a timeline. Are we reviewing just this new site plan subdivision map that we received in the mailer or are we going to go through the sub the site plan the engineer plans that we just got unfolded?

I would say that this is part of it, right? This is part of the application though. It's part of the application is whether or not we've had enough time. Right. I mean Oh, [laughter] I see. It's hot off the press. Exactly. So, as a board, do we I think we need to decide. Do we want to go through this checklist looking at both of those? Are we ready to wade into that kind of sight unseen tonight, I guess, is what I'm asking the board asking [clears throat and cough] because I I just don't want to start in this checklist and have two different visions of what we're checking off as complete and not incomplete. I mean, as far as I'm concerned, I I feel like we can go through the checklist to see if it's complete and incomplete, but we maybe are not ready to get into all of the technical analysis of what the engineers engineer on the plan.

So, you could leave that as incomplete, but I think we're going to be here for if you look at the number of incompletes, we're going to be here a long time. If you just looking at that, right? I So, you want to just pick a time. What is the policy? What's your normal normal term? [laughter] It might be a good idea to pick one now and then, you know, if we've gotten disappointed,

right? I I I tend to agree with John. I mean, I mark it as received, but I certainly would want time to be able to review it. You know, like additional Yeah. I just don't I don't You mean Well, I think we'll get it to the next meeting.

I I mean, I don't think I want to get into We can, you know, we can maybe accept that it's Oh, yes, he's provided that information. What I don't think I'm prepared to do is jump into all the approval criteria based on the information that's right there that

but you might be able to just look at tonight and give them some guidance of we think we need more here or more there. Right. [clears throat] Does that sound like a feasible we okay with doing it that way? Mhm. Okay. So, [snorts] we'll open up those plans and look at those plans and check it off on the criteria, but maybe we won't get into approval of all those aspects tonight. I'm assuming you are going to be talking to us more about this document that was handed to us or

Yeah. Yeah. Anything you have questions on that's engineering related. It'll be more like a sketch plan review. Cool. pit locations. That's on this plan. [cough] that was on the 11 by7 that we received. They're marked on here.

They just used the lot numbers. Yeah, there's a symbol circle with a black hash. It says TP. So, we'll call that one complete. I agree. plan includes a utility plan showing in addition to provisions for water supply and wastewater disposal the location and nature of electrical telephone and any other utility services to be installed on the site. And that's on the big one.

the utility plan. Is that on the profile or if it's not. It should be. been a layer. Turn that layer off. Yeah. Sometimes they do that with a note. It doesn't have to be It doesn't have to be No, it's like first half of the road, second half of the road. Yeah,

this note nine, doesn't that does that cover utilities and this will be granted central main power company, the pound and other for the installation, maintenance of poles, and any other future purposes? No, that was on the last plan.

I I think typically we'll show it on the planet profile. will actually show the utility line running the approximate location of typically what happens is CMP decides where that line wants to go but they have a 50oot easement over the hole right away we'll show it on a plan of profile but just so you know for your future reference when CMP comes out for the field determination visit they may say they'll actually paint the line in where they where they want it you know to flag it out where they want it to run sometimes they want it on the lefth hand side of the road sometimes right hand side of the road just depending on what angle they're coming from from the other line. So, um that can be very simply added on

to this plan. Do they have a standard as far as pole distance and straight lines? Because if I start thinking about a 50ft easement when we get up to the big bend by 6 and three, they're going to go a straight line there someplace and there's going to be a 50ft easement on somebody's

It's all uh underground. It's underground. It's underground with this one. Okay. You're all underground. All right, that makes it easier. pad locations, but I've never got them right. They change them every time they get up in the site. So,

yeah, typically I just take these into CMP and they Yeah, they they put the stuff on the plan, give it back to you. So, [clears throat] so utility plan sounds like still incomplete. Okay. 25 site plan shows the location of all rivers, streams, brooks, wetlands, and vernal pools within or adjacent to the proposed subdivision. I think what we are waiting for was there was a delay with the vernal pool study due to our weather that we were having. The wetland delineation report. Yeah. In the vernal pool report.

That one's on there. What's that? The wetland delineation um Yeah. Right. What I'm sorry I've got myself confused on this thing now. I got two sets of numbers on this plan. What was the question? the wetland delineation um report or survey results and the vernal pool survey. I think it does look like

Yeah, it's it's on the plan right here. The only I don't know. Was it updated? Um the vernal pool. Yeah. Yeah, cuz they're not located. They weren't located until this month. the test bits and vernal pool that was added. So it was the other change that

vernal pools are added. Yeah, there's only one that's right there on the but it's the same. Nothing's changed from last time we met till now. Well, what it is it's it's ver that's that's actually the the state or the federal has that on their significant pool.

Okay. So he verifies he verified it. There are no more. Did he did he go out and do that? This one? Yes. Okay, that was done at the same time that the soils guy and the uh surveyor were out there together doing Oh, okay.

test pits and ver. So, who did who did that? Pool. Who did the vernal pool? The survey. Do you have a um He probably sent you a little memo or something, some sort of report documenting that. I didn't know there was one. I thought it would put on the map put on the plan if there was anything. That was my understanding. [clears throat] This is an updated plan and if they if he had found any

if you could just ask he can with his letterhead draft a memo saying you know I surveyed this property on this date and no additional vernal pools or wetlands in addition to what's already mapped were found. I think that would be

okay. So he is he is he is saying that this is a significant vernal pool. 27 27. Do you know what the setback is to a significant vernal pool? I want to say 250. 250. 250. Yeah. But I think that we took that into account already. Right. So that's the

Yeah, that's done. That's why that the building window's way over there. Okay. Yeah. Right. [clears throat] So on here? That one Vernal pool. Yes. Okay. you'll [clears throat] see wetlands are Well, was there a question about the the is it wetlands or the the wetlands are all on the map?

Was there a question about the flood [clears throat] plane 100 flood plane or something? Yeah, that's that's another one down below here. Yeah. So typically the wetlands uh they just give you like a little wetland report. So whoever done in your wetlands has that.

I had already done the wetland delineation back in 06. Yeah. I think I think I think the question that came up was the how long it had been since this wetland delineation report had been done. Right. And the possibility or I think Juliet you know a little bit more about

Yeah. that there would be an updated one since it's been over 10 years. I mean over five years is is considered almost invalid. So it's been what 11 years now. So um I thought you had mentioned that you would have the the same guy that did the vernal pools could do the wetlands. Typically they do the same thing. So um it would definitely be my vote to to have a wetland survey in this area. Um, there are a lot of wetlands, so knowing where those lines are is really important.

are anywhere near any of the wetlands. This thing purposely designed on top of the hill and there's an awful lot of land that isn't even being used. So, I don't So, do you understand what they're asking for? Yeah. So, uh, it's it's it's actually not as hard as it sounds. So, typically you just verify the lines that have been mapped and, uh, I mean, you just have Mark go out and he'll go out there for, you know, and then issue a letter saying, you know, I've up, you know, I've looked at the site again and these lines are generally accurate. The delineation is still accurate today. You just need a letter from him.

Okay. Can my survey do the same thing or does he if he's a wetlandator? [clears throat] Yeah, he can. Yeah. is the planning board going to want being flagged for the sitewatch? I was just going to ask you guys what you think on [clears throat] this. I don't want to be the only one that speaks up on on wetlands. But so what we're looking at right now is we see wetland icons, but I don't see like a boundary like you know it's fuzzy like where does that end? Where does it start? Are we comfortable with that or do we want like more like a polygon?

three, lot two. [clears throat] See the our map does show up the delineation line. Oh, it does. Okay. Sorry. Let me check that out real quick. So, it kind of looks like a contour line. It might be confusing you. Yeah. Yeah. But this

Oh, I see. Oh, yeah. It does look like a So, the thing is when you go out to do the sidewalk, you just won't know where that is unless it's flagged. Oh, that's that's that's you doing members of this board have strong feelings on sidewalks in the winter. You can't we couldn't do them earlier. Typically probably just a line that's turned off in the

Yeah, that could be. Yep, that would be helpful. Is there a ordinance requirement? No, I believe so. You see the difference, Barry? There's a lot of solid line, but there's not line outlining it here. I can scratch. I'm just saying that. So, in other words, you should have that like you did the

Y Yep. lot two where you've got your building envelope it does encroach on wetlands as well as lot three might just be good to show G says that the plane board plane board will determine whether or not sidewalk is Did we ever do that or

No, not a determination on sidewalk. He did or he did. He did a sidewalk. Drive official. He did a drive by. something from a you know sounds like the guy that does the vernal pools. Somebody that is you know qualified to delineate with just you know a letter back saying you know what is mapped currently is what's out there. Um, as long as you can get those lines for for the eastern side wetlands. I don't know about the rest of you, but that would

So, you're looking for a letter to verify that these wetlands wetlands have been delineated by him and that he's qualified. Yeah, I'm thinking again, sorry, I'm thinking back to that. Yeah, Barry. I mean, I I think the confusion is because you have old information, new information. We're not all clear which lines came from which set information. If this was all like one nice clean package. So, so I I mean, I get the I get the question from is, you know, just make sure it's updated and clean that we've got a fresh recent letter or some confirmation that that wetland is currently.

He checked it. He needs to go out there and check it. And the vernal pools on the same letter or Yep. Same thing. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, if the same guy's doing it, they all covered. Typically, you'll go out and look at a wetland, then you'll see a vernal pool and or not.

But but even additionally to clarify where these lines are is pretty So that's why he needs to go out there. Yeah. he's checked them. He's he is in the field that he's gone out recently. Oh yeah. No. And today was actually the last day for vernal pool. This was the last day in this cycle. So probably you're typically not getting those letters until Monday. You know, people are

doing their last. Yeah. Because they have to visit uh twice to check beginning and end. and it protects you a little bit, Barry, too, because if there is an issue from somebody raises an issue and you go back to this letter from Mark from 5 years ago or six years ago,

and you go, "Mark, hey, you did this." He might say, "Hey, wait a minute. That was six years ago, you know." So, it's it's a little protection for everybody, too. I think I know it seems I'm sure it seems a little bit nitpicking, but I think it's just trying to make sure we have a solid base.

business with him for years, but if I call [clears throat] him and ask him to update that, does he have to come back out to do that or he just update if if if he didn't survey or check for wetlands when he was doing the vernal pools, he'll have to go back out there.

But that sounds like Yeah, but his most recent survey work is not is by somebody totally different. Mike Kavich mapped those vernal Oh, I'm sorry. Oh, okay. Yeah. The the old uh the what was that? That was a 2006 that Mark Cy.

Yeah. Censy. Yeah. That was a wetland delineation report. Is that what that was? Okay. So, I would ask that from Kavitz to my knowledge. Right. It sounds like he's done it put on the drawing. It might be just a matter of

getting him to say something. But if he did it 10 years ago, It was just out there. Okay. This is this work was all by Konavage was all done this year. I'm sorry. Okay. Yeah. Got it. And I know he's he's done he's done the and located everything, but whether

maybe he didn't give me a report cuz I show I gave him that that I already had it. I don't know. Yeah. But I can I can check on that. Okay. So, we're going to leave those incomplete then. Mhm. at one or two foot intervals showing elevations relation to mean sea level and I think when we had talked about this was something that we were planning on making part of the the new plan

is on his road profile plan. Yeah, we have two foot contours on the profile. I think that's the important place to to have that. So I would say this is satisfied. [clears throat] Okay. So I would just ask if you could look take another look at lots four and seven to make sure they meet that 20% slope.

He did that actually on the last on that lot to show shows the building envelope. We actually did an independent calculation um just to verify for because we can do it uh we have different software that that works better and the so lot 7 they did update that envelope that that none of that in that billing envelope that's all slopes less than 25% um just flatter I mean not steeper um

and I believe we checked all the building envelopes to our cows and they were pretty much right on so there were a couple of areas in lot four where it got close. You can see that hill, but it wasn't quite. It was like 24,

right? So, without having the lines at two foot intervals, it's tough to really check it out, but it looks like it was pretty close. So, okay. 29. Site plan shows the location and size of existing imposed sewers, water manes, culverts, and drainage ways. So I think in this plan we're mostly concerned with culverts and drainageways at this point because there's no public sewer. There's no public water. And so that's where this plan's going to come in. That's where the road profile will come into this place. Looks like it's in public. you guys all the

well I I think we're not formally saying I think we're trying to give him an assessment if he's complete or not so that the next time we get together hopefully he's in a position that we can actually get into the meat of reviewing the criteria so we can keep moving this project along for him is is my

Can you point out whether or not any of these things are here? Yeah. So, the culverts are all there. Yep. Um, so if you look at if you look at the top view, they aren't showing up in the profile view. So the profile view is the thing on the bottom and the plan view is the thing on the top. So that any point there's a dip in the road if you'll see typically we describe it by station. So right before station 350 um on the first sheet there's a culvert in there cuz that's a natural pip road.

And so that just conveys drainage both from the roadside ditches and also pass through drainage from one side of the slope to the other. You know it safely gets it under the road so you're not washing out the road. So any anywhere there's a dip, we've actually sized and and put in a culvert. You'll see.

Okay. So as far as providing direction, they're there. We need to see them on the profiles. Y the culvert locations. Yeah, that's so the right. So the the the culver is actually the two lines going perpendicular across the road and the the hatch triangles are the uh the rip wrap protection type.

Yeah. No, I mean in in your profile in your No, the triangle is actually the PVI. So they're not usually you see like a like an ellipse drawing where the culver's going to be. Okay. Where's the culverts up here? Sorry. He's right here. These are the culverts and then the stone.

Yeah. shows it on the plan, but no. So, it's just this one. No, there's I think there's two three or four. So, there's three dips in the road. So, they're always going to be in the dips in the road. So, if you look at on the bottom, it's easier to pick them up on the bottom if they are drawn in.

And actually, some of them, like I'm looking at um I don't know what station that is, 15 maybe. Yep. Um like it doesn't it's hard to pick out that that's a culvert because it doesn't have you see that oh in between. Yeah. So station 14 15. Yeah. So there's an existing culvert in right and we're just extending it out cuz that's one that's that's already installed.

Rip wrap or anything there? No, we should probably add some protection to that. Um, and then also along those lines, that's um would be good for for your guy to make sure he looked at that if that is a stream running from that wetland under there. Um, [clears throat] the plan is to increase the width of the road or to pave it. Is that

No. No. Are we increasing the width or anything of the road? Well, it's just it's an existing culvert there, right? It's not long enough. When he builds the new road, it's got to be the town standard. Yeah. But when we're building the new road, are we extending the width of the road?

Yeah. Widening it out. Widening it. Yeah. Just basically just a a logging road. No road logging. So, so uh so knowing where that wetland line is right at that culbert um would be good to see if there's going to be any impacts.

actually on that other plan that shows the detail the width and the show detail. It might actually be on your detail sheets in here. plan. [music] just on what this looks like. you're asking if this extends under underneath the road, the wetlands.

Yeah. with if the impacts are going to impede in that wetland. going to fit within the 50T right away. So looks like outside the 50 right away right on the right on the door. That's what we need. So if it's that could be

typically if it's in the center of the 50ft rightway you would have 25 ft either side. So it would be well for the right the road width would be what 20 was the overall width 22 I think. Yeah. So you'd only be about 20 you'd only be 13t 14t 14t

from the center line. So you'd still be how many feet? should still be 10' still be 11 ft from the side of the edge of the rightway in with a road. I mean, unless there's a huge cut and fill there or something. That one comes down both that slopes to that

sides of a drain. [clears throat] Yep. And then the basically in that area, everything's kept in the rightway. There's enough to keep all your fill extensions inside the going to consider this item though drainage ways locations in profile view

and adding those rip wraps. Yep. Have you heard of before? RIP. RIP. RIP. Is it one word or two? That's the question. Two. It's always two when I spell it. I I've done it both ways. You're spelling it wrong. But I think we use we have it as one word. But yeah.

Oh, take my word for Mhm. I like the way you think. [clears throat] So we'll consider that please. That looks like number 30. Site plan shows the location and type of any easements or restrictions. Looks like wetlands. just got mine. You don't Okay,

that was the utility one again. Going back to that utility easement again we talked about when you add right so is that well the well so the easement is the right away so right I'm trying to remember why we didn't so that

my notes say utility there's a note on the his new subdivision plan that says utility is meant to be granted a CMP with it right away so right that's probably more that note was actually on last oh I see so that's all on this Right. So don't want to leave that as

what's that number 30? Yeah. We already had that as complete. No, we got this sheet showing it complete and I'm questioning why. I'm with you, Barry. Huh? I had it complete. Any easements or restrictions? Utility easement.

Right. And then so that's the CMP and there's a note 9 basically saying it'll follow the right away of the road. engineer was going to show it on this plan as well. Yeah, that's probably because my note just says incomplete engineer. So I think maybe you volunteered yourself. [laughter]

I forgot. would be complete and then the number 25 is incomplete because that was supposed to be on the utility. So I as far as I'm concerned I mean he has the note in there on his subdivision boundary plans about the utility easement for central main power that is covers our need for easements.

This shows the location of any location and type of any easements or restrictions until must be shown in deed restrictions. Dean restrictions that was already completion, right? And note 9 says utility regarding the century power and others maintenance of poles and other. So yeah, it does just say that in general.

trying to figure how you exactly where the CMP e lines are going to go until they actually put them on. the same. Yeah, I know. I hear you. Well, it seems to me that note is more of a legal looking for the legal description of it, whereas note 25 is more of the engineering,

right, description of it. But easements, right, too, right? Utility, right? Um [clears throat] did um so you guys had the existing condition survey done is that kind of what you did or just the topo survey. So I'm thinking if the existing condition survey was done then that would show

easements. Right. Right. So the surveyor re when he does his when he creates a boundary survey. Yeah, that'll pull he does a deed re he does deed research to find any existing easements that are on there, right? I'm sorry. I don't know what

I I was just saying that maybe that would he would have the utility the easements right and restrictions on there if possible. So the only the only ones that would be on there are no existing ones I think from the so it would just be the proposed ones which are established by the rightway. Sometimes there are D

restrictions like no cut buffers or so we don't I'm assuming we don't have any assuming we don't have any of those at the point but so that would be something that you'd show if there was some special phosphorus buffering or which I don't see any

yeah I kind of feel like this one's covered Okay, complete. I agree. That complete. Um, going back to the wetlands one, I'm sorry, this be the last thing. Can you make sure he also flags or marks streams, jurisdictional water bodies? If you just say jurisdictional water bodies or you know what I'm talking about.

Um, so we say wetlands and vernal pools, but also streams that might be jurisdictional would be good to know too. There might not be any, but it's it's just part of it. It's just it's gonna be in the wet one anyway. Yeah, it's gonna be it's part of it. Just make sure.

I'll put it I don't think you have any having seen it, but Okay. in a floodplone area, the site plan shows the boundary flood hazard zone and 100year flood elevation. Did you there's no flood hazard area within any building envelopes. Area flood zone is land adjacent to Libby Brook. But I think maybe we were looking to have that marked on.

Yeah, I think just added to the plan. want him to add the 100redyear flood line if it's where it is. If it falls within the limits of the land, what if it doesn't if it doesn't fall within [clears throat] the note on there says no. The note right now says that it's somewhere on here.

Says it that there isn't it isn't within any building envelopes. Okay. But Right. So if it's not on here, then change that to say on the property on the Yeah. Yes. that there weren't any or was Well, his note says that there aren't in the building envelopes, but that leads me to believe that.

My guess is that if this is waiting bird habitat or something that there that there may be a 100 year flood zone line, but our ordinance doesn't specify. I mean, our ordinance specifies if it's within the subdivision, not necessarily within the building envelope. So,

yeah. And it does go on to say that it is adjacent to Libby Brook. 33 site plan shows areas within or adjacent to the proposed subdivision which have been identified as high or moderate value wildlife habitat by the main department of inland fisheries and wildlife.

Were you guys able to um I think you were going to send a letter. Yep, we did send the letter. We haven't had a response yet. So, you should definitely get something hopefully by June. Actually, they I think they have a stipulation. [clears throat]

If you don't I'm I'm not sent. If you don't hear back, I think you have like 30 days or something. Yeah. But that's It hasn't been 30 days. So, Okay. Usually pretty quiet. So, that's something we're still waiting on. shows areas within or adjacent to the proposed subdivision which have been designated to have a critical natural area by the main natural areas program. Is that the same letter?

Same thing about Department of A. I think you guys were going to send a letter to them. So I don't know about Department of Agriculture, but yeah, main natural and usual areas, right? They get a letter too. It's two separate letters. It says the same thing. Okay. There's two divisions within ifwes

says consult department of a I'm not sure. I don't know what we were guessing. We were guessing who controlled that. Well, no. I mean like in this thing. Yeah. Well, no, but I think I think that was our I think we typed that in.

Yes, that's our note. I I think that's the whole thing of where's there's no more planning department for the state, right? You know. Got it. Okay. But that should be the W development. I will change it on the next version.

I'm sorry. 36. Applicants provided street plan showing a plan view profile and typical cross-section of the proposed street. The plan view shall be at a scale of 1 in equals no more than 50 ft and the vertical scale of the profile shall be 1 in equals no more than 5t. The plan shall include the following information. Date, scale, and north point indicating magnetic or true. Intersections of the proposed street with existing streets, roadway and rightaway limits including edge of pavement, edge of shoulder sidewalks and curbs. Kindize location material profile and cross-section of all existing and proposed drainage structures and their location with respect to the existing natural waterways and proposed drainageways. Complete curve data shall be indicated for all horizontal and vertical curves turning radi at all intersections and centerline gradients. So that's all the things. See

pretty standard and I think I believe everything that you just read is on these plans. Maybe one thing might be good and maybe not a big deal but showing the um the other road that we come off of. here. It's cuz we can't quite fit it at this scale. But if I go to 40 scale, I can get it on here. 10.

You can kind of see the two gravel lines in. Yeah. Yeah. So, if I just can buy another inch, you'll be able to see that. So, on a separate sheet, a detail sheet, put it in the No, I think I can I think I can squeeze it up. If I can, I'll

incomplete until we have a chance to look at these ladder? Um, I think it's incomplete because I think there's a few things that Andrew is going to add such into the he's gonna he's going to issue us another revised set of these plans because [clears throat] of the collars and a couple of these other things. So, I think this that one plan revision would take care of this and the other things that we flagged on it already.

Okay. I mean, there's a long list here. I mean, is there anything else that anyone's noticed right off the bat that should be on there that's not I don't have any issues with your show. moment. Do you see anything you would need to as a road commissioner who

tweaks and so adding that intersection with the existing road more detailed culvert information. Anything else for Tweet Strong? Do we have a covert detail? Do you want a cover detail? We have a standard. I'm assuming you guys are okay with HDP. This is never going to be a town room. So, so yeah, we'll put your standard HDP cover detail in with rip wrap protection

with the D50. entrance, that's just temporary, right? Yeah. Right. It's just to keep although you know looking at this road another gravel road right when he and if you think there's going to be any tracking you should put it to where you're going to get to pavement so

it might be something as Barry improves I'm sorry I forget the name of that Collie Hill Road what's the name Granite Hill Farm Granite Hill Granite Hill Farm Road that's the one where you'd probably put it before you get out to the pavement

where you get to up to Yeah. Yeah. So, because this whole road is constructed and improving Granite Hill Farm Road, all done within the project. All the material is on site already. There's no nothing to be trucked in. Nothing truck.

I'm just wondering if it's necessary or if you just say temporary if needed or something. Yeah. Well, I can just I can just add to call it temporary so that we know it's coming out. It's part of the er standard erosion control package just

looks like a permanent detail. I'm sure he's got a whole clip art banking [laughter] memo. that one incomplete. provided subsurface wastewater disposal system test pit analyses. Yeah. Yes. of the proposed ownership, improvement and management of all facilities and improvements that will be privately owned and maintained including streets, open space, range facilities and recreational areas or facilities including do including common dogs together a draft of community association documents if an association will be responsible for the ownership or management of any land or facilities and the declaration of covenants conditions and restrictions.

this was related to the road maintenance agreement? [clears throat] Just making sure road maintenance wasn't listed someplace else. Am I ready? I think this is what we were talking about on that one. Well, the one above it 44. I in my old checklist I had that as incomplete and that the note there asked to provide homeowners association documents including road winds agreement. So I don't know if they're tied together but

I had that marked as complete number 44 and then under 45 was pending proposed deed with information on the road maintenance agreement. It typically an association if you had common area but I don't know how many common area no so it's just the road maintenance agreement that we have

so I think yeah I think the note that I have was that that we were we were there was some encouragement from us to provide a more detailed agreement that would meet the town's performance standards we submitted this and what you have

and I think I think also So the related to the deed was there was I think there was talk of a like a sample deed or something for the lot that was that was those things were going to be worked together which is why [clears throat] I think we left 45 as incomplete.

the tapes. said remove from the plan. you they had asked me in the first meeting to remove it was on the plan and it would be dealt with by the road assistant the road what was on the plan I had a note to remove this we had that on the first plan we had I can't

remember what it was but it said when when you asked there was a few things you asked me to get a letter to wave and he asked me to take that off the plan. The very first plan had legal document. No, I'm not talking about that one now. I'm

You might have had a note on the plan saying the road was going to be maintained by you or something and they taken off the plan. Yeah, just there was something on there that that they had me remove. So, there will be a road association formed for Spring Road,

right? That is what we And so you provided this agreement. Um, is missing is not really describing right now is talking about what with maintenance. something out loud cuz I'm just reading this for the first time and I'm not a lawyer. So [laughter] just for your background information, that's the standard road maintenance agreement that the state of Maine suggests. So typically what happens is people find themselves living on a gravel road with a bunch of other people and this was never established.

So that is one actually the state of Maine gives you okay it's been vetted by the attorney assistant attorney generals or whatever is being something you can just fill out and have notorized and recorded as long as everyone signs it. Um

so sorry to interrupt you. No. So, I mean, this talks about the creation of an association under main law will be a nonprofit corporation, and it talks about um you're going to have to maintain that the association as a nonprofit corporation in good standing, and that the costs for maintenance will be by competitive bid. Is that I guess my understanding was that you are going to be doing the road maintenance work personally.

He's doing the initial construction. I'm doing the the construction. Okay. But you're not doing the I actually uh I haven't really okay know anybody who whenever the first buildings go in there then these people it could be a maintenance agreement between two people at that point until all seven are sold.

But I did for the first one I sold I I told the guy that I was taking care of it for two years. I would do that. That was that was in our agreement in the the uh documents for the sale. Okay. So, that's because nobody can come in and take care of that and maintain it until I get everything. He's he he's on the other road and he can build before we get get the whole subdivision done. So, basically, I told him I would take care of it because I'm in the process of building it.

So, after that point, then then the owners will be it's going to be uh like I say, a competit competitive bid. I would think that we could maintain it because we'll be involved. [clears throat] You know, it'll probably be a while before all the lots are sold. And

so, since we just received this this evening, I guess the takeaway would be if you could tailor this to your Right. And that's what I was going to say is that you typically you take this and then you fill out name of the road, all that stuff. So, you'll have to you'll want us to go through and sit this. I can help you with that.

Okay? because we'll take out you probably don't want to have a [clears throat] there probably won't be an association there'll just be a road maintenance agreement and then you'll assign it by lot instead of individual. So the owner of lots one through seven will have each have one share of membership of ownership.

That's a weird one. deed and the deed will reference this document. It'll if you can't see the deed, you're going to find this. Well, yeah, that's that's exactly what I'm like wrestling through my mind is I mean I think the agreement's a solid piece, but it how do you tie to the deed?

The deed would say this would be an attachment to the advance is subject to maintenance agreement to be recorded here where it would give some leave those pages blank and they would be recorded together. But at least everybody buying a lot knows that it's subject to a they know enough to know that they got to go look at this document that they're going to be bound by some going to be responsible for some level of maintenance.

That document gets recorded anyway with the with the sale of the property. Well, it would go with the deed, but the deed would reference this document. So, anybody looking at the deed would know automatically that there is an agreement,

right? And I would actually I'm sorry. And you'd probably want to record that agreement at some point, too, just so I'm going to say that's where some of these have fallen down. We have that problem in in town. We have people who buy homes have no idea that their home is in an area that's in a subdivision with a association.

That's why on the deed you know soon as you look at the deed, you know you're subject to this. It's not the first owner. It's usually the second and third where it gets So are we asking for a sample deed? Is that what you would like to see? Is that

I would recommend a sample deed, but it's tied to a recommendation. Easy enough. and complete cost estimates of the development and time schedule for construction including anticipated beginning and completion dates and sufficient financial capacity to meet air and water pollution control standards and other standards and criteria contained herein.

so like that's that would just that's just mostly I mean that's just for the that's for the road piece, right? That's the whole financial tech technical capacity to complete the project criteria. statement that uh at the last meeting I think but I don't know

I don't have any notes on it. I don't know. I think you said it couldn't be uh it wasn't sufficient until we saw the road profile and realized I could realize how what I was going to be required to do. engineer did the road or your estimate was accurate anyway?

It's accurate. schedule wouldn't be accurate because I can't schedule it. I'm going to need you know 6 months to get this thing done. Get this thing done so did you just say that um [clears throat] you wouldn't be able to provide a time schedule for construction? You just you're not sure

until until I'm we have final approval here. Yeah. I can't. Yeah. My completion my goal is to get this thing in before winter. And I think that's what I had on there for a completion. Target the start date is maybe just like you know approximately a month to take it would it will take approximately a month to construct or something. However long you think it might take

possibly. Yeah. I thought I didn't put that in here. Yeah. I mean just I think I did consider beginning date to be June and be complete by December 17th. Isn't that what I had? Yeah. Yeah. I gave my chocolate check. Oh, I see. I'm sorry. Yep. You did say that. My apologies. Six months. Okay.

Yeah, usually we get something from the financial institution. My bank of that. I I do business at the credit union and they don't do that kind of thing. They basically lend money on a individual situation whatever it is and they don't I'm not

proposing to borrow any money from them for this project. So it's not there's no loan proposed or in process or anything. So I think it's usually that you know the bank will say you know Mr. So and so does have the financial capacity to to fund this proposed amount of money and then that's it. I think usually that's what we see but not saying we have

I asked them to do that and that was the answer I got. We we do basically a a situation letter. If you were borrowing money from us to do this project, then you would say yes, we we will loan you the money, but we're not asking them for any money.

Right. So, remind me, Barry, are you doing this under your LLC? No. You're doing it personally, right? So, would you be willing to provide a personal statement from a bank account showing that you have 25 grand to build the road?

I I put that in there, but I I didn't uh I don't know if I signed that thing, but basically I I stated [laughter] No, just I'm not trying to find it. That's you check. You just had a cost estimate and a time schedule. So

that's it. I didn't I put in there about the money I had available, didn't I? Yeah. Between Well, no, just how much you think it's going to cost and that you have the money available in your savings account. Actually, make a statement.

You want a statement for me? how much I have in my savings to do this thing. Is that what you So I try to get the bank to do it. They just It's not a I try to think I mean I I don't want I know you probably don't want your personal bank account on public record but at the same time we need to know that you can get the job done. So

maybe like a copy of of my bank statement my balance and my bank statement. I won't I don't want to leave it for everybody but if you would like to see a copy of my bank balance I'll bring a copy for you. Let's see. And so at some point

or you can get a letter from well typically what some clients do is they get a letter from the bank saying you have the cash reserves in your account to fund this project but I I know you have a credit union and I know that they're they don't

they don't typically they don't do these types of things. Whereas if you have like a bank or savings a nor savings bank they have a form letter they just print right out there for you and sign it. And you got most money.

No money. I like the way they treat me at the credit union. Yeah. So, at some point, that's why I'm there. At some point, um, we would be discussing the permitting process for these houses to get permits and maybe we could tie it into that like the road has to meet. Maybe that's

that's maybe we'll get to that. That's certainly going to be a condition and then we could try to cover some of that and that that the road has to be I mean I I never could quite understand this thing because nobody else has anything uh anybody potential um buyers or whatever have anything involved in this process. If I don't get it complete, I'm not going to be able to sell houses.

Well, that would be so it all comes back on me. They're not going to get billing commitments unless the road's there, right? But our our challenge is, you know, we're trying to prevent. The guy who starts a project underestimates what it's going to take and now has made a mess and is like, "Well, I'm out of money."

That's what we're trying to ensure that you you're in a position to be able to start and do do the project. Yeah. Um I can try to come up with something, but I I guess I need make sure it's going to work for you. I've done one before where Hancock Lumber wrote me a letter that said I had unlimited credit with them and that the town of Gorum accepted it. What they want that's what I submitted and [clears throat]

your financial institution or or statement I think stating that I mean I think it's hard it's hard to that I have we don't if it's from your institution we don't need to know how much you have in there. just like he said

that I have% of my own money to cover this specific project. [clears throat] Well, see then and I already tried to do that and then if not that then then I'm going to go on the hook, you know, to say, "Yeah, we we said he did." Then all of a sudden I don't complete it. Somebody's coming back to the bank and said, "You said he did." So

Well, that's all it's all tenuous, too. You can move the money off island then we're screwed. I mean, yeah, there's only so much we can do, but we need a little more than what we've got. I I think is is the point. Just try take try try to take another run at that. I mean if you can somehow with your with your financial institution

sometimes do a cash performance guarantee. You put the cash in and then upon inspections it gets released like once once the Yeah. I don't know if your ordinances are set up. I don't think but that's how most towns get around it.

Just do the cash performance guarantee and then they release the funds as you finish. I guess that that brings up another way you could do it. is if your institution won't do it, then you could go out and get a bond. You know what bonds cost and and No, they uh they're not easy.

No. And they're very expensive because the bond guy's looking to make sure you got the backing, too. Yeah, it's the same situation. Now, uh I don't have a problem with showing a balance of an account. Does that work for you?

Yeah, but you you do realize it ends up being part of the public record. We'd have to have a copy, right? That would be in the file. So, nothing to hide. But you can you can X out numbers and all. Yeah. Yeah. All we need is your name and then the balance. The rest you can

Yep. All right. You can also open a separate account and just put that exact amount of money into it and call it subtitle it, you know, mineral spring estates or something. Yeah. Which number is this? 47. Okay, month. I'll take I'll pay copies. I don't care if you have it. I don't want it for everybody. Oh, well, it doesn't matter. I mean, I I mean, couldn't you just get a letter from this credit union saying that he has x?

It sounds like It sounds like they don't want to do that. If all they got to say is is this my client has $25,000 form letters you can take. One of them says as of this date our client has you know more than this amount in a [clears throat] savings account and we understand that he's

every every applicant that comes here has provided us some form of that whether for the simplest things additions to their homes and things like that. So we should be able to get there somehow. It's easy enough if you're getting a loan, but if you already have the money, you

Well, no. I mean, even some of our applicants have been doing it same as you, out of out of savings and such. And how do they do it? Just they've gone to their financial institution and and got a letter that says the he has the money in

they've shown. Yep. Okay. So, well, maybe they'll go and just as he says, that's not putting them on the hook. That's just stating as of this is the money that Okay. storm water management plan pro prepared by licensed professional engineer etc etc. Uh applicant should either provide information or request written waiver was the note I had on there

and you'll get a statement from us saying what permits if any that uh he has to do. We just haven't got that far yet. Okay. So, you're still planning to do my note says applicants engineer plans to submit a plan or letter stating that one is not required. Okay. So, that's still pending.

Yeah, we cut it just under an acre. sedimentation control plan in accordance with the main erosion and sediment control handbook. Applicant must road that's on the erosion control. No, it's in detail control plan by engineer satisfied.

There's an easy one. Yeah, I think that um so is this it right here? Yeah, just the third page. Yeah, there's you you wanted to add some stuff to you wanted the river detail for the comments. Well, that's So, that'll get done when you submit that, right?

wait. Is that what that is right there? Is that No. Do you have any check dams? You're going to need a lot of them going up down those hills, I would think. Yeah. So, your max grade is 8%. So, yeah, we'll not showing up. We'll we'll add a check dam detail in there and

proposed location. Yep. Some major erosion. But again, that's in his drainage plan. That's not in his erosion control plan. No, that won't that'll actually show up on that plan. It'll be in here. You won't actually get a drainage plan cuz you he doesn't the the drainage is all going to be on everything's going to be on these sheets to construct it

as it is right now printing any change it. He doesn't really need a normal storm water. So, are you saying you want to add something to the erosion control plan? Yep. We're going to add the check dam details and locations. So,

what is that? What is that now? That's a ditch, but they work. Okay. What's it called? Check. Stone check dam. So, they slow check dam slow the water down. So, it's in place. the water checks in and till they fill up with sediment and then run over the top.

Well, but they're good initially to get you through until the grass catches. They hold your water and then once you got a full catch of grass, usually remove them. Yeah. Okay. Or they get blown out anyway eventually. 50. If any portion of the subdivision is located within an area identified as high or moderate value wildlife habitat by the main department of inland fishers wildlife site plan indicates appropriate measures for the preservation of values which qualify the site for such designation. So that's related to the other one. You're still waiting for the letter

get something back from subdivision is located within an area designated as a critical natural area by the comprehensive plan or the main natural areas program site plan indicates appropriate measures for the preservation of the values which qualify the site for such designation. We're still waiting this

of the amount and type of vehicular traffic to be generated on a daily basis and at peak hours, etc. I'll give you a little traffic statement there. Typically, you're looking at 80 total trips daily with 8 a.m. PM peak hour trips. So, usually it doesn't even register on anyone's radar. So,

you're looking at 10 per per house, per dwelling. Yep. from single family dwellings. 10 total trips per per day. That's a [laughter] lot. Guess our street doesn't seem so busy anymore. It says max. That's the IT manual. That's based on your suburban America 1960s7s sort of thing. Could

outside Philly. [laughter] Yeah. So it looks like we had said if there's if you have a summary of the project, you can just add that information into a summary of the project. infrastructure improvements with cost estimates prior to the sale of lots that will be completed by a professional experienced in preparing such information. Evidence that the application has financial commitments or resources to cover these costs. I think that was that's related to the one we were talking about before.

Same with 47. This one's specific to erosion control and environmental. I was almost going to say this one is asking for specifics on what is going to be used to construct, right? Like, you know, I don't X amount of cubic yards of

Right. So, they're looking for quantities. So, I'm wondering if um we are if we accept that letter that he gave us, which doesn't list anything. It just says cost. And I wonder if we should almost wave, you know, you know what I mean? It's not included in that.

What's that? Does that say for the lots? Says prior with cost estimate prior to sale estimate infrastructure improvements prior to the sale of the lots. We're looking for an estimate from an engineer that And did you see the note in the next page? [clears throat]

Mhm. So if he takes care of number 47, then we're good. Yeah. And I think what Juliet was saying is she's maybe questioning if maybe that's you know he um he's not telling us the number of cubic yards of fill number of coverts all that stuff and we might be okay with that and if we are then it's almost like that's what number 53 is asking for

looking for a verification of they're looking for professional opinion of of cost construction costs right goodness. Okay. have gravel on site, correct? You have probably an estimate of how many yards of gravel you probably have on site, right? It's a pretty good idea.

Yeah, probably 10,000 yards. So, if you gave us Andrew can probably do a quick cut fill off from the [clears throat] software and say, "Here's the amount of gravel you need to fill the site." And Barry has an inventory of gravel that meets the requirement. Yeah, we can give you a quick little

That's something you can do. Y I noticed your plane has a lot of fills and not very many cuts. Not a very good balance. Well, if you drop, you know, he's got to put um you know, 20 inches of gravel in there. So, if you drop 20 in from that line,

but by the time you grub that out, you've already got 5T. By the time you grub this out, there's another foot, foot foot and a half. That one it did. I did know. Yeah, it was. So, you're going to have 7 ft of material there. Likely.

So, we'll we'll refine that. I try to cut more here and balance it would lessen the grade too. Slow. Yes. Well, and Barry had a couple of comments on where he wanted to move some stuff from offsite onsite, you know. So, we kind of looked at it from

that's going to be a charge on material. And then that also impacts your um your fill extensions. You're going to have areas where your filler extensions might not fit in your 50 foot right away. [clears throat] So just uh

Sorry, I was looking at the ordinance. I missed what is there something that we decided? No, he's going to do it. Sounds like number 53. So provide a list of Yeah, provide a list of possibly what he what he has available.

Yeah, he's going to do 53. ordinance had more specifics on it but did not. applicable state approvals and permits. Uh applicant must check with D to determine whether any permits are required. It says NER by permit or somewhere permit due to location of Libby Brook. That's my

send a letter to D2. applicant must check with D to determine whether any permits are required such as a NERPA permit or a storm water permit due to the location of Libby Brook. Yeah. So that's kind of an interesting one. So we typically don't. So we know the rules and regulations, right? So what we'll do is we'll make a statement you know I'll make a statement to that saying

you know total impervious area created post 2005 is this does not require any DMP per so we don't DPS doesn't respond you know if you go to them and say hey I need you to sign off on something because it doesn't need anything they typically okay don't

but the nerpa is that similar so the nerpa would be if you're filling over a tenth of an acre of wetlands um or if you If if there is a stream on the site that someone comes, you know, the delineator says, "No, this is a stream." Then he need a PBR, you know, for a stream crossing, which we provide if if indeed he needs one.

Okay. So, if it comes back and the the delineator does say that is a stream, then after that, you would go ahead and Okay. Right. And we and then everyone gets a copy of that permit because it goes to the DP and the town.

So, it's almost like for I'll be the first one to get a copy. So, I don't know if that's incomplete or just not. You're talking about a stream that would where the that would cross the road. Is that what you're talking about?

Yeah. Under the road that you might potentially impact, you know, with your road widening. No, just potential. But, um, so would that So that's so that's saying so we're saying there's potentially no there's potentially no applicable permit.

Record to that number from a licensed professional. So, so you but this would be all state approvals and permits. So, what else is required? Yeah, we talking storm water and all that stuff. So, he's going to give us a letter saying it's not they don't meet the threshold.

Going to add that information and then if the NERPA is needed and others, we'll have to cross that bridge at that time. that the application is still incomplete like you did last time? Sure. So, before we do that, I move that the application remains to be incomplete.

I'll second that. All those in favor? just didn't get it in time to get it in the package. That's actually my fault. So I was just genuinely [laughter] nice boss. You are [laughter] application to be complete before you do a sitewalk? Is that

Well, I want to do a sidewalk. I would say you probably want to do that sooner than later. I'm just going to You might have a comment that would affect what? Right. But I am not sure that they're going to do it. Should we Let's have a discussion. I mean, what do we I know Ann's strong.

Not a big fan of sidewalks. Well, she's not here. She's not here to [snorts] sway. Um I think this is an interesting enough site that there probably is some value for us to to do a sitewalk. um to see the site um an official sidewalk. I know we've kind of maybe cruised around that area and know it a little bit, but

I think it would be good to do a sidewalk with the engineer and Mr. Baldwin. Looking at our ordinance, it says upon a determination that a complete application has been submitted for review. The planning board shall determine whether to hold a public hearing and sitewalk.

That's right. Because it would be part of the public hearing. All right. So, it sounds like we can't do that until this has been deemed complete. Hearings for this. Will we hold a public hearing? I think it's called a public hearing because you're forming as a

if we're all coming together to do something. It's the same. Joe's got some info for us. I'm going to try [laughter] when we send out um the notice with your agenda. I will put a preamble in there that this will be a public greet meeting for the purpose of a sitewalk. Give the lot block date, location, time. Um, I

don't know if you were here when we did the clerk down with the horse farm. For some reason, I personally didn't go on that sidewalk. I can't remember. It might have been in your your time. Yeah, it wasn't too long ago. No, I I remember the application. I just wasn't personally

okay, which is what the is saying. But the ordinance says we can't do it till the term is complete. I mean, yeah, that's what it says. It's so backwards. Well, this the the application is complete. You still haven't gotten to the consideration criteria. You still haven't uh

So, there's no way we can do a site visit before we finalize this thing or I think you I think you could, but I think it's just poorly worded. I think it's just not written well. Yeah. Um, upon a determination that a complete application has been submitted for review, the board shall determine whether to hold a public hearing and sidewalk. It's page 73. It doesn't say that it says and then it says in the event that the planning board determines to hold a public hearing and or sitewalk, it shall hold such hearing within 30 days of receipt by it of a completed application

and it has to be published in the newspaper apparently. The only thing that's missing there is typically if you're going to do a sitewalk you would mail the butters so they can attend the plate sitewalk. Whatever. That's not in our ordinance. So that's

No, it doesn't say anything about butterscotch It's not a meeting. All right. So, I guess we can't do it right now. Sounds like the way they really wrote that upon purposely put it in there twice, right? Whether or not we agree with it.

How about I extend an invitation to Anyone who's interested in a sitewalk through the you can call me and I'd be happy to meet you there at your convenience and one at a time because you can't have two people, right? I'm not sure I'd personally be comfortable with that, but

on the same page. I Yeah, [clears throat] I just want to make sure we do I mean I don't want to open ourselves up to Yeah. any questions or issues. So, where's our list of things that fix our ordinance? Too bad it's going to take a year at least for that.

Well, that's actually I was going to ask, are you considering rewriting just just did this is the new one. [laughter] And I'm sure Andy and I would volunteer some time to help you, you know, because who would? Oh, so, uh, my partner Andy and I, we do, um, you know, we we've done a lot of ordinance writing for other municipalities and things.

Well, well, we've kind of we've been working through it for a couple years and it's we've been trying to find a process that works and, you know, all of us just kind of sitting around going through it has not worked and getting different people in to help us with it has not worked. So, it's kind of a finding the way to move it forward in a timely fashion and not spend a lot of money. I guess [laughter]

right now the comp plan board took all of our money. we comp a town locally that you really like how theirs work. [snorts] Yeah. I usually pick a tenant I know that they've lawyered everything and just take theirs because you know it's been vetted and it's well scrutinized.

Yeah. I mean at this point we're going through a comp plan so we might not change too much short term but some of these technical things that we just stumble over like this like all marked up anyways. the site plan would be beneficial, but

until we site visit, what what was the urgency on that? Well, it's just a timing thing for Barry. So, if if if you get out there, then you say like, oh, well, you know, we um because you know, once you see a site, it's completely different. You're looking at the plan and say, well, if there were just changes that came from that, it would cost him extra time. Okay? versus. So, it'd be nice to get all that kind of out of the way. So, that

vote on the whether they're going to do a sidewalk or not or not at this point. Thanks. Thank you. See you next month. extras. isn't it, Barry? I don't think I folded this right. I have a question. What's What's this? That was if we had gotten to the point where we deemed the application complete and we were going to start going through

guys. Gotcha. Okay. Oh, so actually maybe one thing we could talk about really quickly. So beyond the so the approval criteria for the for subdivision is what Jill had had provided to us in the document. But beyond the approval criteria, there's a section following that on the performance and design standards which which kind which I it looks like they line I think we worked to make sure they line up

but they're repetitive but it's repetitive and and what it says is that there the performance standards are intended to clarify and expand upon the approval criteria. So, I think when we get to that point, we'll probably need to be the way I was thinking we would be easiest to do would be have the approval criteria checklist, but having to refer to, you know, where it says, "Oh, it's not going to cause undue pollution." I think we're going to have to go through these performance standards and actually, I mean, it's they're really long.

What page page does that all start? It starts on page 81. Well, the approval criteria starts on page 79. Okay. So, it looks like the performance standards kind of expound upon that criteria. 81 to I mean it gets all the way there's

road crosssections in there. It goes all the way through to 97. don't know. I mean, I guess we have to we'd have to make motions on each approval criteria, but I can't imagine we'd have to do it on all of these performance standards, right? I mean, we're allowed to wave some of these performance standards. Oh, based on a written request of the applicant.

Oh, jeez. So that was just my thought process for how we'd approach it. If anyone in if anyone in thinking about it has or looks at it and wants to I mean I we can't we can't read through all this stuff. I mean out loud we'd be here for hours.

That's interesting. Page 90 is the road maintenance criteria for the road maintenance agreement. Well, that might have been helpful. Says what's got to be in it. Oh, good lord. Page 83, approval criteria or 81 is the performance standards.

numbers aren't lining up with what you probably got an old one. So the subdivision ordinance has been looped into the general land use ordinance. So, I'm not sure if you have a separate subdivision tab, but that's probably

um Nope. It just goes land growth to land use to flood plane to historic. So, in land use, you should be you get your table and it should start on page 71. Your land your sub subdivision should start at 71. What's the covered page look like?

2016 town of Durham land use ordinance. So, it should as adopted at town meeting April 2nd, 2016 is what mine says. Nope. Yours is off one page. Yeah. 80 instead of 81. So just off one page. Oh, it's a lot. It's a lot to me. [laughter]

Might have a working draft. We have no What's that? You have no idea what you have. He does. Yeah, you probably got a working draft. Oh, he does. Yeah, I think I would. That's what Annette sent me was the working draft. I think I would can that.

Uh this is what to me. But you were given that. Yeah. I'm just going to look at the website now to see what's on the website cuz uh oh the one I just pulled down and gave you. Oh, is that not Unless we got the wrong one.

Well, April 16, what's on the website matches this one I have here, but I'm just curious if I don't know. Just let me double check. other day when maybe I didn't cross reference it with my paper document either, but because you said you did it.

Well, no, I took it right off our website. That's Oh, okay. I mean, that's the public. Um, while we're So, is So, wait. So, so do can we like have Barry like read through [laughter] this section? Well, he has read through it. His engineer certainly understands it. His engineer Sure.

So they should be so they should be aware of what's listed in our performance standards already. Okay. They should whether or not they've read it is another story. Engineer is being paid by the applicant. So we we kind of got to look at it and make sure that

page 7473 requirements for subdivision like they talk about that's our checklist that we're going through. Right. So they talk about on here, you know, things like dimensions, ground floor elevations of all existing and proposed buildings, driveways, walkways. [snorts] So

you won't have that detail for the homes until they build those homes. So that'll become part of the building permit pull will have that level of detail. So it's almost like, you know, and that's something we need to fix, I guess. But that, you know, if this is going to be standard from what we see that this shouldn't be in there

or or should be optional or something. Yeah. If applicable. What are we going to say? Waved. Waved. Waved. Right. this time. Right. So, you got page 92. It's got the financial and technical capacity requirements. So, it's what on

I was trying to find that while we were talking about it and my my wasn't lining up. Where is the PDF? You said 92. 92 has the financial benefit. That's an old one requirements. One that he gave me that. Um, so you have the same one.

I have the same one as he has, but but your pages line up with mine. Number 12. These are weird. Did your nothing like that requirement start on 74, page 92 of Oh, here it is. 91. I'm sorry. Financial and technical. But that one's not that one. That one's not the new one, is it? Or potentially.

Mine doesn't say January. Does yours say January? Different ones. No, we mine has that. We must have Did we make changes between January and April? It should be whatever was adopted at the time at town meeting. Yes. Is what it is. Whether it's right or wrong, that's what it's that's what's been adopted.

Why is there January 16 published on the website? And why do these two have that one and we have this one? 75. Yeah. See, like, so, so when we were talking about financial capacity, I wanted to look up article 75J and I couldn't find 75J anywhere in my book,

but you just pointed me to page 91, and it's it's 12. It's 12. It's 12. Yeah. I don't know where 7D5J is. Apparently, we got two different ordinances or two different versions. You don't have 12. Oh, yeah. I think about that. Financial.

Yeah. But see right here it says per article 7D5J. Oh, I see. That came out of the old ordinance. Probably that's on page 76 in mine. Anyways, it is 76 under supporting documents. So you'll go you'll go through the application submission requirements

You get to five which is supporting documents and you get to J which is 5J which is literally the same text that's already in there so it doesn't give you anything new but so okay does that actually line up? I mean I'm not sure what you have.

Mhm. So ask why we have seven on the website. Half the board has the April ordinance in their binders. So some of us have What does some of us have? What do you have, Calvin? Okay. Mine just says 20. I think the difference is that you and I were already on the board and so

you probably kept your old ones. No. No. I think once it was passed April second once it was passed I think we made she made copies but but then whoever made copies for the new board members or others grabbed the wrong grabbed the wrong document

but be looking on the website and making sure that what's on the website matches. That's this one. January. It's yours. Oh, January. And yours says what? April. April. Oh jeez. We got three different versions going on, [laughter] don't we?

Yeah. Yeah. He's got his pages wrong, too. So, we've got one two. [laughter] You probably just have I don't know. I don't know what happened with that. There's a clerical error here somewhere that we got to figure out and track it down.

Yeah, the website needs to be updated with the most recent and the most recent is what and everyone should the most recent should have been April 2016. Yeah, that's the most recent one that's been approved at town. Supposed to be in a tested copy here at the office that was signed by the select board. So, I need to find that.

Thank you. And that's the one that we have to copy and destroy everything else. Yikes. [clears throat] Yeah. Shannon might have tested the copy and given it to Yeah. Okay. I have no Awesome. Well, yeah. We'll get you a new copy. The camera is still running though. [laughter] Okay.

So, you know page we're on. Yeah. Motion to adjurnn. Second. All those in favor