TranscriptBudget11519chap2

public works that's gonna go in there and then forty six thousand one hundred and three dollars of the oven panel road funds are gonna go back in there total of two hundred eight thousand five hundred seventy dollars let me leave us balance in the phone the four hundred and sixty thousand two hundred and ninety nine dollars an example public

works capital requests two hundred thirty six thousand five hundred dollars from a new truck yes appropriation me like last year the French to the truck was quoted as two hundred and ten thousand actually be twenty thousand

both of those this week the cost of Steel is that an actual quote or its it's an estimate within five percent increase whatever is not spent on the club truck would go back into the capital fund so I mean we're not going to go out and say we gonna buy this really exciting I'll check for dollars if we can buy one for two hundred twenty percent of years and

how difficult is it to get a accurate Christ what is the truck truck is a brake Freightliner tandem axle or zero Franklin of the International Date so it's a wheeler a tandem axle truck they all about twelve to fourteen yards of material just come just like the three ribbons we have now the newest ones same thing and this comes right with

everything needs to pop yep Wow well would we buy it from from dealer yeah but you up to a plow builder custom does though to your specifications quite a bit to it it's not like you're going off the watch and how long does it take for

delivery on average about six months yeah year probably wouldn't really help us for the next pilots it's improved in April shouldn't you be on air by November when we get it adjust or team sort of processes approaches so the trucks about

hundred twenty and then the other one hundreds in velvet outfitting the truck with side dumps all the high-tech [Music] possible that we can have that you can have you know sent this out and then we can have an actual number with by the time the budget committee meets in early February you're not gonna get an actual look at the budget numbers nobody's going to give you their bottom line Toto put some two-bit devil come up with an RFP and then everybody bring us at best price of a had priced or was that a

ballpark over the dealership I'm going to be doing this year were they looking like camera about to is recourse and why we couldn't they said far but obviously far the spouse must also but this is why can't we just buy enough time for a while and it's not the same thing it looks like a dumb property the outcomes have different fun ends different strange to get all that weight on one side so your Springs from you all people things have you it's made specific ball problem here you have dump truck drive down the road travel to say underneath it's got a whole lot of stuff I apologize for my

amnesia I know I asked this question last year but I don't remember the detailed answer why buy it will release considering as you said it's dispensing corrosive material and just dying of cancer anyways it's not really at least

they call the lease but it's not at least it's called lease finance and all these burners and basically it's the same thing as taking a bond out it's just that at the end of the financing it's just a different way to finance a truck basically I don't like what the car at least payment you get like way more people that you would get if you bought it it is it's more of a financing way to

you still enough oh wait yeah we looked at it with the fire truck past year and it has ended up being more business they don't really want appreciate us double back we did look into it though based on your other that'll rob this research it didn't make sense might

easily I called the town McCrae and ask them how they were doing it they explained to me it's really no different right it's just different the other it's like suggest a clarification that by the time the budget committee meets the only February you may have a different number force yeah get your actual file odd won't be an actual number a budget which is you see how close your estimate is it's still going to be an ultimate ultimately the way this if the way this article will be imported would be to see what

some of money there that the money would be coming from capital reserves raised money this year and then it's it's it's it's always a up to select the recommended up to this number to thirty six five and maybe budget places up to 230 and the town boats what's the ceiling that

believe a truckload other things but as soon as you publicly say that number and those people those vendors who are going to submit a bid that number could be higher than what they would have submitted a bid for right now you already told them yeah but it's but it's

uh it doesn't typically really impact things because they still have an interest in giving you it's still competitive good price but you're right I mean ideally we want to have an estimate as close to reality as possible and so Calvin's gonna go back and get you know check his estimate you know and see if if that's realistic

estimate or maybe I agreed I always say the same thing but you know what if you if you don't ask for the money everybody around this might be thinking they're going to get they're watching that if you don't ask box you don't know if you're gonna get it and it's all public knowledge that's the problems I mean anybody can come in look at all tell the same way the chance of everybody bidding on the exact same number if you put 236 five in there someone's gonna want any business try to get five guys they're not and I think that was evident when we got the plug she's maybe bought estimates back they were yeah it was definitely evident and they didn't watch the beat II didn't know how much

nature of it is that they all know they got five competitors bidding on the same project they all want to they want to meet the next guy so is that what happened with the Auburn problem Kolbert is that why it came in so much slower yeah that's another so why was our

estimation so off like where do we get our estimations on the others that one came as an engineer's estimate based on the specs of the job why do we have to why do we have to tell a dealer or drunk or wherever we get this from what we have to spend a little bit well we we don't tell them but if they happen to do their research and look at our town warrant or watch the tape of our town meeting they can see but that all has that's all public that's all it has to be public right right okay I thought we were talking about going out to doing the RFP or going out to bid prior to the meeting that we had over more accurate price right and but if we do that we don't give them that number in RFP but

is that the plan we're gonna ask for an RFP would be pending approval or well just double-checking our estimate no they wouldn't send an RFP out until we have approved from the town to go buy a truck so but I think kalmyk nd without a formalized RFP is just with a couple of phone calls say hey were more of an informal bid process of hey this is what we're looking to do we you know ballpark what are we looking at so why can't we

do the RFP first because in that way there is Susan because it's a waste of effort quite honestly yeah you know if we call one person ask for that just so we have a number to come back with and then we put that out to bid then on the like we've been that again once they file this for other people budgets and I'll just keep it budgets are estimates they're not a list of actual future expenditures cattle calls

made it seems to me I would make my estimate on the high side because once becomes public knowledge that we have up to its higher for my son I like when a pony 240,000 and so now that becomes a number of how long I'm thinking but I bid this I'm going to bid 230 give it a

way too much I think you're giving them way too much credit in it that they pay that close attention our town no I said if they do that's what they would have to do if they wanted to and I dad I think frankly I've never run into that anything you set out to bid where where somebody has come back to us as it will teach you guys appropriated this much money how come your how come you know you know beat me down so much it's it just it just doesn't happen just doesn't work out what was the highest bid

those pretty high several hundred thousand right above the lowest even with that information out there they all don't I think they don't want to be competitive it seems and they don't they don't quite right you know they're all there have been none stuff for me lots of towns you know they don't they don't have the resources of the time and it's not worth it quite frankly for them to be scouring every talents minutes and warrants and seeing well what did this time incorporate for that because ultimately they they say everybody else

you know to take your case but everybody else would be doing the same things but everybody knows the same stuff so you still what am I going to do to compete to win that bid I'm gonna have to come in lower than that I think it's a valid argument then actually bid process great

we can only buy from O'Connor we want to you know we want to raise two hundred thirty six thousand so we call it O'Connor you can only buy from you well it's two hundred thirty six five driving the driving factor in the RFP process is that they're concerned about what they're the competitor is going to give a price that's what drives the processes trying to be better so it's fine with

vodka approximately how many vendors my the I reviewed be sent down to well it goes to I typically will send it to about five or six people that I know are going to be the pizza I won't send it to a mechanic or Peterbilt trucks it they don't do we know it was one international freight liners for the Western spa it's going to go up to about five different pendants that's just what we get about four or five is there a lack of better words like when you've

been upon to use to thirty six five number you takes a base model truck I it's all based on the specs like we're saying is could you could you get it let's say a basic truck for two third you that is that the basic basic or is that maybe up to you know four hundred thousand for example it's got all the latest waves GPS technology so rocket racket it's whatever is in our spec we don't expect anything that's really based on your specs isn't able to are you suspecting a middle road truck a basic truck basically a basic truck so that's about as low as cooling seats so you

said earlier you wanted to get a Freightliner tandem Freightliner dealerships are there in the area but he's competing heavily against Internacional against Western star against so sir we going for whichever is the best price are we going to pick up the freight liner for the best price I mean there is there's some there is some

level of keep the truck somewhat the same so that we know we could buy the same parts in the way that I don't want to have to have since the stock parts for the nancial and stock parts for a Freightliner but depends on what the difference close I think that's a judgment call the Lord makes if there are a thousand dollars every we might choose the great liner it's $9,000 difference

much that really only the Freightliner can bid on it and it's custom made for the other companies right the bid will say if you can't meet the spec you have to listen why you can't meet it and does it exceed the spec or does it mean to spec but it's different it's a different perspective at the end of the day you're

not going to be ready right we don't we don't tailor it so that only one person can bid oh it was quite a bit of work actually put a desk back way back when we started this whole process where I was involved wrote commissioner at that time was involved it's a quite an extensive that said and it isn't you know I'm one afford I wanted GMC conversations it's weights of axles engine power the technology the plow control configurations it's it's very very technical towards what the truck needs to do the job and the task it is designed to do you know the rate of spreading sand and the variability of that and how those controls work it's not it's those things it's not a sea and radio and you know it's it's a pretty thorough spec actually that I'm assuming we still use the same one we built a bunch of years ago and possibly this seems to be things to be updated that beefed up the front end from 18,000

to 20,000 that's where it should be for a firearm though but that's their part of that most of the spec for that tractor water I should say what happended to see is in the HP Fairfield or whoever does the order gets the bid for the Center for the outfitter gets this one there's a lot to do about that cost as much as destruction I think rich

the question - the basic truck I'd say the chassis is pretty basic there are some things that we asked for I mean yeah we can fill with a single axle truck save some money but it's not really gonna do the job for us so we do ask for ill pre-wedding and tanks on the trucks and we get side dump bodies and that are you know better for the application of the salt and stuff for that we have ground speed control on theirs but it's all its those are cost-saving measures so we're not spending you know two hundred thousand on so long I spend a hundred thousand so that's not I wouldn't say that that's basic I mean you could go with the old dump truck and sand her in the back and probably save a little bit of money but there were these trucks are mainly used for ploughing there's no control that's the way to go their front trucks walk in

and they buy stainless steel bodies add another 50 grand of that that's their kind of preference there is variability I would say four by four but so there are some options so this is fairly basic but it has the technology that we need to do the job could be different

why Freightliner usually gets a bit and it's because they build a chassis for that that's the market that they compete in Western star and international do try to compete but more often than not especially in the Northeast it's Freightliner that comes in well they've won every bit so if I remember right you

did also buy software for the Botanic or something like that yeah yeah just do a double check on ASCO well we were getting the trucks the first two trucks we got required to the last bit that the whooping so mr. trunk would have the turn host code and there's a compliment I don't get this it's I don't care whose fault it is you sold in the trunk you get it fixed I don't care if it's using all of your fault so that's the way I do others I want everything in woman I want somebody attends are they responsible to in turn so the guy the truck deal is

going to get 10% or 20% well I know usually when they submit their bids they submit the openers numbers they when they get this bid they send the truck out to the outfitter they get their number back and they submit them together but I didn't want to pay for separately or I didn't want to hire HP Fairfield separately from the truck I wanted it all chocolate so I know they didn't market numbers up because I already had to remember so but I just made them supplying the trunk with old truck outfit so the number was 210 last year we actually purchased the

truck for I think it was two hundred five thousand that was after trade in no no that was before trading and then after trading we paid about a hundred ninety four thousand we don't have anything to trade in this year it has no

tires in the back this can go for scrap at least right raising seven hundred and three thousand twelve of the negative five dollars [Applause] we have liquid bondage number five out of ten the room bond is three out of seven three and a seven or what attitude

yeah it's in the budget overview so if you look in there it out like something that Charlie here we're gonna be paying on trucks that are no longer in service that we purchased when they start Public Works there's two new ones and then the Bible

everything out that if you see that's in this timeframe is worse than the one we have an opportunity to buy this other than you up with those old trucks that we had but I know I do think financing equipment for 10 years that's already 10 years old seems a little yeah not a good way to go

probably should've done a couple different separate well I could send two excavators yeah yeah do the building a little longer one here's get Dean that was long and then some of that you can really bond some of that stuff I like the building can you read on that and extending any bond if we want you to keep cost down I know you can't afford insurance I'll be entertaining I don't know what we're paying on for interest now but bina 31 sometimes those rates come down so it's in you guys and that's access to address to for the time we researched it when it came time to actually borrow the money for that we actually got a better interest rate on bolt holes actually we got a better interest rate I think originally the buildable got about fifty one of them is about

three and a half percent I think the other way just a touch over four percent might get a little better than that you probably should look at that two years ago - right so what's the thinking about using more of the capital worse balance capital reserves balance I don't know we

have this the first time we're seeing the pool - so we haven't had conversations like Calvin what is it they gain on not using more I will other than to say it's typically not good practice to spend your reserves to zero every year or even close to it I think I

know I mentioned that we have two trucks that are in that 20 year range so I think ideally we would get one this year and capital reserves and another one next year again out of capital reserves and then that would essentially have turned over our fleet and it would be a few years before we need to buy another on another big progress yeah we're not

doing 10 years in 2018 we pretty much increased our revenue almost enough to buy this truck it's $28,000 short thousand yeah that's insomnia that's kind of it that's really that 46 is really more of a paper shuffle than anything that 83 693 was in we show it

as an appropriate nation to give us permission to spend up to that much out of capital reserves but we didn't spend we didn't spend it so that 46,000 is essentially plenty money back that was already there it's not right I guess I'm saying though is the town of proof spending it there's a sense you could say that it didn't get spun to you could say now it's being reshuffled to buy a fire truck you can reword it however you want to reword it but what we were anticipating going down last year we didn't so we had we are now

two hundred eight thousand five hundred and seventy dollars richer more whatever word you want to use in that account than we thought we were going to be a year ago but that like I said earlier that's you know there's lots of ways to

get money into capital reserve account so in a town that for instance doesn't have any of these parameters where operational balances get rolled into reserve accounts they'll they'll have an article on their warrant asking for $200,000 to be put into reserves so it's

a bit of a you know like many roads lead to the same place kind of thing you know so yeah you're right in terms on paper it's 208 or 200 $8000 he added a new money though it's it's about 160 thousand because the 46 was already there but yeah so that's the balances so if we spent 2:36 that's going to leave us what that would be the beginning your balance what was that 224 ish and I think we're I

think what I'm hearing both the Budget Committee and the selectmen err of the mindset that perhaps we want to challenge the operational budget and public works do not come back with a 10% overage so I would anticipate less operating money overage for public works going in next year actually that sorry

yeah over budget so if we depending in so if we have the year to 24 and then let's say if we get I think we're going to ask for another 50,000 straight contribution and then if let's say let's say the over budget is cut in half and it's like 50,000 so we put about a hundred thousand in we'd have a balance of about 324 and if we were looking to buy the truck out of that we're bringing them pretty far down you know get well under a hundred thousand dollars example when's your next truck request I think we're looking at one this year one this year that that best that cos asked the two the two trucks that are about 20 years ago is your the budget

you presented last year for president you presented at the town the capital the capital yeah I just don't have all of the information I need to do that but I will have an updated version of that for you before you actually start your budget meetings so I just want to say like Ben didn't count much use in a similar position in a different town just remember that what were approving is up to an amount and he's not allowed to come in so there's always going to be some so yeah maybe 10% is too much but

he does have to make sure he doesn't handicap his girl and as a department and then he can get through three year with some unforeseen circumstances and or so that we have in kettles well we did have the trucks need enough labor that may not be possible every year so I just want a caution again I mean yes it's in a way it's good but we're also kind of penalizing women saying well I'm going to give you what you had because you didn't spend but I don't want to encourage him that don't be like the baby just burn fuel budget hi did you get your shirt to that end I

mean I think it's going to be looked at the the reserve money could be used if there's overdose right which right now it can be so I again I think let's say we have we have a committee form to kind of look at a new capital improvement policy and process that that might call for some changes and how the money is

not ordnance but it's it's past a town meeting that operational voltages for fire department and Public Works rolled into those departments capital reserve accounts so we would to not do that anymore would require a town lobe at town meeting to stop that practice again

yeah I think the board hasn't discussed it yet it's on the table for us to discuss they could kind of in conjunction with what the capital improvement Policy Committee comes back with I haven't seen any of their work today I have no idea what they coming back with or a recommendation but that's those are the types of discussions that are on the tables to better manage our capital money and not just to provide like a current year flexibility and how monies can be allocated but to make sure that we are responsibly planning out years or expecting capital expense because the flipside like the Sigma sake of argument if we don't send operational

overages into capital reserves then that will increase the amount of money that we are asking for in a capital reserve any given year in a capital reserves article so and quite honestly that's a little risky because of this town has not always been you know psyched about putting money there have been years where I said nope zero and you know and deal with that but it is it is risk and there are there are people that think that that it's an

incentive for department managers of fire and Public Works to be as tight with their budget as they can during the year and save as much as they can because they see it as an incentive to have that money go to their dedicated capital reserve accounts to be spent on they dedicated their so there's there's

reasonable arguments both ways but that's the discussion we'll have once we hear back from the capital improvement currently if any department over spends their budget where does that money come from so if you overspend and we'll we'll actually see this before the department's issue if you overspend at the bottom line then what has to happen is we actually have to have a warrant an

article on the warrant in 2019 to basically ask permission from the town to take that whole bridges out of undesignated funds to make that account square and I think we're gonna see that in what did you say they didn't hold up two fingers you have two two accounts not taking about it's not huge amounts by any means but we are gonna see a couple this year well I read something

really scary the other day like actually I don't even want to say it in some way if you there have been cases where if an account is overspent and weren't really watching it very closely somebody can rap can file suit and the

selectmen can be held personally liable the other day oh just one thing I'll call up to the Budget Committee for the new members this you'll make two separate recommendations here so the roads to be finished with the railroad and Danielle drawing different

do the state isn't that the swamp yeah so sugars a Quaker meetinghouse right we don't know yet supposedly do tea is which will be filled that intersection approach any bullet is actually going to shift 125 to make that a more gentle curve as you're going around that house that is like right on the inside of the turn that's a do T

project and it's supposed to be in 2019 project but I just asked Alvin or the brain if he's heard from VOT and we haven't already hit definitive yet but I think those numbers include yeah that's certainly not 2.1 miles from swamp - I

think I was going to take her Brook Road and all the way through let's just verify that this is okay just to make sure our estimate isn't one rebuilt a little rug and then focuses on road from swamp grove to old bunch of bro total 5.75

forty dollars eighty percent across per barrel 355 so before you guys actually need to discuss this they provide you with break down the tax attack of the bond and what the out schedule is you know like we looked at last year so you'll have so this would theoretically

be over a ten-year bond as well like last year's was you know a so you could ballpark it then you know this ten-year bond we did this is the first year payment it's a little over two hundred fifty thousand dollar payment this would be again about two million all along the interest rate something that difficult they were last year so you know back of the napkin it's another 250 now

proposed a four million dollar bond that's right it was a vendetta to town turned down so did we get I don't recall getting any inclination that they would approve splitting in over two year period are we just hoping and asking I actually I actually swallow this once I actually spoke to several people that

we're a little bit confused by last year's bond didn't realize that you know it would have been split over two years the initial two years anyway you know in a three years so I think you know I'll only speak for myself my my point of view has been that you know we identified the work that needs to be done and we're coming up this is what I would cost for do it and do you want to do it and that's that's what I feel the responsibility of the board is is to bring these questions to the town

see if that's what the town wants to do we we may may not recommend that yeah we think we should do it or no we actually this is a lot of a cause will be think we should wait a year it like said we haven't had that conversation well I'm wondering too if there'd be any benefit to bring it to the town ahead of Town Meeting no to have a discussion as you

said there were people last year that were confused maybe get a better feel from people so that if there is the opinion that one person speaks louder than others just to get a better feel of exactly it seemed like it was more of

just an argument last year than nice to try and figure out a way to make it be more of an educated discussion yeah I mean I think I mean we can always do a better job I think you know last year I went through a everybody I think now

that we kind of have the phones of that we could conceivably get that up on the website you know well before Town Meeting that people could go look at and we drew and see you know what we were talking about I've actually thought about that for a lot of things where we're going to ask because we're going to ask the town some big questions in the next year or two you know and think everything related to possibly you know

let's say for instance changing our fiscal year from a calendar more fiscal year the alliance with the state we may you know that's something that conceivably the board might come and ask the town or you know do we move to a town manager or formal government versus what we have now those are those are some big questions that it's going to be important to get a lot of information ahead of time they're not just like show up at Town Meeting and all the 15 people right they'll still be

a firm believer and everyone in town offices just we've got to do a better job in communication and getting information out earlier and making sure everything's accurate on the website so I mean I agree it's a two-way street you have to read you have to listen you got to do that sort of thing - won't even

look at the tax toast when they give it they come down to vesicles where all the money's going to they they point to them two sentences write down the tax bill could you know leave on the bond to get us back in the topic we could put it out

there to say yeah okay you know this is the information and the selected recommended yes and the Budget Committee could say you know we recommend we wanna or we recommend half that or we recommend we just do metal room or we you know whatever whatever you in and that's that's what we discuss on why is

it estimated 19,000 more per mile than this year that's a budget we don't know what the of a community asphalt asphalt is higher this year the laborers left Labor's definitely on there these are budget numbers when the kids canoes they show you the labor side

because every town stealing three weeks while the minimum wage is going up two bucks and I are just Calvin isn't the scope on this with a little bit more extensive of some of these roads with a lot more some more material being added than some of the others that have just been with full grind in the pavement over the top of injection looks like you're adding a lot more mature we

didn't have any six-inch weekly there it's last year you're right week there is more it's more scope to these roads than we have more farmers cutting that old run with it road and Hillary would need to be raised up to get out of the water table we're already got the one difference we can't ditch out of the way out of it so we got a pin we can't bring them round or grab a run it down so we got to bring it up there with total outstanding that

number on each other on so let me actually your town war and it's part of whatever there's a bond question part of the bottom question always has to include like total town current obligations and you know what's wrong to look for the peace we didn't provide last year route that I want to make sure we call up this year is you know there are guidelines for an appropriate amount or you know

for debt for a town to handle based upon its size so we should call out where are we in relation to that you know like are we like maxing out on a credit card or you get like half our limit last like um email about algebrats

similar talents I believe Ruth is it aren't there like state guidelines yeah we're we're spire to not go over a certain amount we're actually close to so it's a certain percent of your valuation is what you can borrow off the top of my head I think it's five percent but I'd have to actually work

economy she was asked for the budget like even this Frenchman once the totally backed up by yeah oh yeah actually tried to do with the stuff last year about know it works in general effective for the town to do it ourselves or what we did before we can't

just put together some numbers to have for you guys tonight I had done presentation PowerPoint presentation very similar to this looking over the past ten years 2009 today and the costs associated with the stuff there were some tweaks that the board had wanted me to to do on the presentation and with my audit and stuff I just haven't had the chance I will email that to you as soon as I have the time and then going

forward it's the town wanted to I mean there are studies that you could do you could actually three pretty close I brought last year's book and our last year of hand contractor I think was some rough some of us around 700 yeah there's

just appalling rules and the average and it's a similar to what Ruth had that she gave us the other day she brought that up by numbers person would be close and the average over the course of that five year contract was about a five percent increase so if you add that up five percent each year it's somewhere around nine hundred thousand a little less just to plug the ropes our

whole budget is just under a million three our whole budget for Public Works is 2.2 million the capital would be no matter who you still because I did something similar to got different numbers than you I mean you have the factor well you do get a factor in I mean not baby but the equipment bonds I mean that goes to the cost so that's part of the budget even if it's not effective in operating the new trucks another two hundred thirty seven thousand my president local factors in the capital yeah over those numbers hearse doesn't hurt members of mine when she did that I had to chuckle to myself because I had done it this way without being this specific issue so I would say this the we are not going to do a

feasibility study on public works as part of this budget process if we want to form a committee somebody wants to ask selected to form a committee to look at that we'd be happy to have that discussion but our job is to pass a 2019

could be asked like I will say that if we're going to do something like that we need to have a true finance professional involved because we to this point we have not had that in any of the either the original analysis or subsequent analysis after that so because there's it's a very complicated thing how do you measure you know productivity you can't just take you know ten years ago we spent this and now we spend this and divide it by the number of miles of road we have because that doesn't say anything about what's being done to those miles of growth or what condition they're in or anything like that so I have no issue with taking

a really good look at it but it's not gonna be free we're gonna have to hire a professional to do it it's not part of this right process and we'll try to not have it be part of the town meeting discussion I mean certainly people can express feelings about it the desire to have things looked at but we're not going to be on town or whether we should have wanted this because at the end of the day what was decided in the past what happened in the past is irrelevant the only thing that matters now is if we

wanted to do something different than a way differently than we do it now what would that cost in the future that's that's cuz that's a comparison sake now we can do things differently in the future what does that look like it doesn't matter at all what they cast at Alice's it would it be appropriate for the budget committee to have a discussion and so to choose to make a recommendation say you're already talking next year a plow truck is going to be doing I'm guessing that plow truck has a plow roof to put that one root out to bid could that be part of the budget process for next year with that appropriate recommendation rather than review the entire I think it would Public Works Department I mean the the role of the budget committee is to make monetary recommendations on budget markings but I think the board would certainly be open to you know feedback

from the budget committee about questions you're curious about things you'd like to look into we can discuss explore that but it wouldn't be something that would go on Prince's town so we want to add 2 oz dolls for a piece of goalie study right we're chatting online yeah you pick to see what they do that actor that's what that's the financial record either do it

or you're gonna have to wait to the next year's you never I would encourage you I would encourage you with to meet the stuff that Ruth has put together first and look at that and look at whatever out rolling and then come to your own conclusion on whether you think I think

I think that's more when I'm curious is that we can just give the town a little bit of encouragement or confidence that we we are okay like you know it seems like there's big amounts here and bigger boats there but the overall scheme of things we are okay I don't think they

have that reassurance I think that's a very good point I think especially to use the word confidence when it comes to public works I think is right on I think the I think the level of performance and the value we get from by the worse is well beyond the confidence that a significant portion that it just comes up every year yes yes because it's new and it's

unknown and it's you know there been some bumps in the road and part of it is the way people talk in small towns to say there's a lot of perception that oh we're gonna save money and I don't from I remember the community work it was like we're gonna control our destiny and at that time I think the thought was we were gonna make the investments in the roads that you have made the last couple years and that that is going to cost you money whether you're doing it with a contractor or whether you're supporting with your own forces so I guess you know the real bigger question is is doing it with our fourth force is cost-effective and I think there's been some attempts at quantifying that as well but the last few years of it being a contracted thing it was very little being done on road maintenance and that's why I think work getting it right now because it was absorbing the plow increase and absorb

the plow increases over the plow increase in less and less on top coats and ditching and cross culverts and I think we're paying for it now I think you need to get a lot of mileage of rotary service for the price with plow truck as I said I think that's what I I think I know it's different from the what we're here to do but I think it's a responsibility to the tax rate for the town to look at it because I'm concerned and I don't I think if it's costing more I think the town needs to be ok was saying it was a mistake it was a mistake

cost for a road like compared to the plow truck is that what you just no I just said you could get a lot of resurfacing done for the cost of a plow driver we're talking training some 1,000 for services to 30 but that call plow trucks gonna be in your contractors being cost somebody's going to be replacing that truck brother is I say

you know look look at the numbers that roots kind of sent here our work and these are these are not you know these are audited numbers like by a third party so it's not like these are just you know numbers any buddy here or a town office you know put together these are these are audited numbers by the RKO

because careers in process behind it but all the historical stuff is audited numbers so Ruth you're doing the past 10 years we had 2009 in that PowerPoint you then know I guess what I was thinking was the comp it was the comment being made that not a lot of actual I want to

make sure you use the right word new road work Shelvin for when we're actually doing the FDR and reconstruction okay so the chatter right now is there wasn't a lot of reconstruction done prior to 2013 so when you when you see the spreadsheet you'll see that the road bonds are not really included in the spreadsheet the reason that they're not bring unincluded is because that is expenses that we would have to have occurred one way or the other and you'll see a break that

out you know I will certainly explain in my slides with where my money thought process was in the figuring but the plow contract was paid over a seven-month period and so what I did is I took the base expenses of the public works over the seven-month period use that plus whatever winter expenses are specifically you know like the salt and that kind of stuff and that is what I consider the winter portions I had originally included a hundred percent of the equipment and the building bonds and Laura had suggested that I used the seven month figure out of those you probably could argue either way just

wait for it that is just curious to the town to say they know the point that the budget is great or the past three years because of the road reconstruction we've done you know something like that is what I'm curious to know is how much of the added expenses are in construction and how the added expenses in fact today we have our own public work also I committed

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